WEBVTT

NOTE
Podcast: Acts 29 Vancouver
Episode: That you are my disciples – Part 3 – Bearing Fruit
Publishing Date: 2023-11-05T05:00:44-08:00
Podcast URL: https://acts29.ca
Episode URL: https://acts29.ca/that-you-are-my-disciples-part-3-bearing-fruit/

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that you are my disciples.

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We were talking about how there were three or four

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things that Jesus talked about that said,

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where he said, you do this so that the world may know

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that you are my disciples.

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So we finished two, and today we go on to the third one.

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Before we go there, the reason we talk about God

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and deep calling out the deep is because deep is the place

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of God, deep is the dwelling place of God.

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Deep is the dwelling place of God.

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So if you look at say, Psalm 18, verse 11,

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he made darknesses covering his canopy around him,

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the dark rain clouds of the sky.

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You look at Psalm 97 too, clouds and thick darkness

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around him, righteousness and justice are the foundation

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of his throne.

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You look at 1 Timothy 6, 16, Jesus Christ,

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who alone is immortal, who lives in unapproachable light,

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whom no one has seen or can see,

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to him be honor and might forever.

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You look at 1 Kings 8, 12, then Solomon said,

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the Lord has said that he would dwell in a dark cloud.

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There is this idea of God dwelling in the deep,

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God dwelling in the deep, as in places

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that are unfathomable to us.

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And so this idea of deep calling out the deep,

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and if you listen to Jeremy praying, he said,

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oh God, we come to know your mysteries.

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And if you listen to the word that was spoken on Friday,

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it is, can you plummet the depths of God

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so that everything in life is just a milestone?

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It's never the finish line.

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God dwells in the deep.

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How do you describe the deep?

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Think of the ocean, think of some of the deepest parts

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of the ocean.

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Remember that thing that imploded?

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Yeah.

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It couldn't go right till the end.

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Before it reached the end, it imploded

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because of the pressure.

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Think of the ocean this way and how deep it goes,

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where there are things yet undiscovered.

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That's just finite.

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It's created.

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Now think of this God.

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And therefore to have any other finish line

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other than the depths of God is absurd.

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Because every other finish line would be a mirage really.

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You haven't reached the end.

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So God dwells in the deep.

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God's intent with Adam was,

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can I teach you everything about me?

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And then when you think you've gotten to the end

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of who I am, I'll teach you some more

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because I'm infinite.

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There's a difference between deep.

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People talk about, oh I wish there was some deep teaching.

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Deep teaching is very different from the depths of God.

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So what we have substituted the depths of God

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is deep teaching.

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Oh I want something deep.

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It's very, I heard this new preacher, he has deep.

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It's a difference you find between the professor

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who explains how a plane flies and the teacher

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explains how a plane flies and the test pilot

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who takes the plane up in the air.

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That's the difference.

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A prof can sit and tell you how a plane flies

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but a test pilot that takes the first F-35 into the air

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not knowing how that plane will operate,

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that's testing the depth.

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Go after the depth of God, not anything else.

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I mean one of the things that I felt

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when Pastor Mike was talking about all this is,

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even with us, yes there are places we want to break into

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but once we break into it, it'll be the shallow.

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Every time you break into something

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it'll still be ankle deep.

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There's knee deep, waist deep,

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to go to a point where you can't survive.

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And that's what the word says,

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that every time you think you have come to some place

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you will find that there is more.

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And it is true, once you know hunger, hunger will return.

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So the question is, if you are not hungry,

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is it because you have not known hunger?

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Or is it because that hunger has been fed with things

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that just fill your stomach?

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So simple question to each of us here.

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I remember a time, I mean I'm looking at Aaron,

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and I remember a time when he and Renny would come

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and visit with me in Denny's.

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There used to be a place called Denny's

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on Southwest Marine and there used to be a place

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called White Spot on Southwest Marine.

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I don't know what people have against Southwest Marine,

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both those places disappeared.

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But I remember meeting Aaron at Denny's,

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this was six or seven years ago, and Renny would come there.

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I think you drop this every week, right?

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No? Okay.

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So, so, it's okay Sharon, I'm just kidding.

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You're welcome back next week and you can drop it again.

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This is a very friendly church here.

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So, yeah, so Aaron and Renny would come

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and Renny would be hungry, huh?

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And she would want, Aaron would sit there like,

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my God, I didn't know this was part of the deal

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if I got married to her.

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He had zero hunger, dead as a door knob.

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He would just sit there.

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Right Aaron?

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Yeah.

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And then at some point something happened

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where hunger happened.

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And then this guy began to take strides.

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And it's odd if that hasn't happened to you,

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ask for it, eh?

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And nobody can say you don't have hunger, you have hunger.

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You know it.

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And if you don't have it, one of the coolest things to do

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is to go and ask God for an appetite.

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Go and ask God for an appetite,

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and say please, I do not have hunger.

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I'm fine where I am, I'm settled here, it's good.

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I don't wanna go further.

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Ask him for an appetite.

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And then you won't be able to help it

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because things will change.

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So,

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here's a problem with the depths of God.

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No one is ready.

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No one is ready to take on the depth of God

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if he or she

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is not fed up

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with status quo

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or superficial.

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You can't if you're not fed up with status quo

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or superficial.

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Nobody is ready to take on the depths of God

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if he or she is not fed up with status quo

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or with superficial.

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And if you are ready,

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then

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no one can step

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into those depths

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without

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drawing aside.

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Without drawing aside.

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No one can step into those depths

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without drawing aside.

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You cannot.

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I'll have to draw aside.

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Every time God wanted to show David something extra,

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Moses something extra, what would he do?

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Pull them aside.

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For how long?

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40 days sometimes.

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With what?

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No cell phones.

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Worth no food.

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Or maybe not as bad.

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Right now we could survive without food

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but not our cell phones.

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But he would call Moses and say,

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Jesus, before he steps into the greater depths of God

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here on earth, call aside.

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There is no stepping into those depths

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without drawing aside.

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So the first one is there is no

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taking on the depth of God

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if I'm not fed up with status quo

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or with the superficial.

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How do you know you are

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not fed up with status quo?

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How do you know you are not fed up with status quo?

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How do you know you are not fed up with status quo?

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How do you know you are superficial?

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One of the odd ways you know you're superficial

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is that you will be criticizing everything else

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that is superficial.

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The deeper you go, the less you criticize the superficial.

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The externals, the unimportant stuff.

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No one can step into those depths without drawing aside.

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Here's the odd thing with the prophetic word

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is that God will give you a word like the one we received.

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If we don't, let's say not we, if I don't,

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then God will cause circumstances to arise

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that will force me to.

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And then if I don't, he let me be.

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But he will not give up without a fight.

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When God gives a word like he did

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and that word is only for his benefit,

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though we will enjoy the journey,

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it is for his benefit,

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he's saying I want to do something with you.

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17 years I brought you this far,

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I want to do something with you.

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And then if I don't, if you don't,

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let's just take me as an example.

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If I don't, then God will not give up without a fight.

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He will cause circumstances

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that will force me to draw aside.

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After that, if I don't,

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then he'll move on and find someone else.

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You'll find this in the Bible again and again.

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When the ones he had chosen refused to walk in his ways,

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he would then find ways to isolate them

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or take them into the wilderness

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and appear to them in a way

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that would bring out two consequences.

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Either they would change or God would say,

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I gotta move on and find someone else.

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He almost did that with Moses too.

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And so if that applies to us,

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then it applies to us as a church too.

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He will not give this up without a fight.

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And then if it doesn't work out, he'll go on.

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It's good that he doesn't give up without a fight, eh?

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Isn't that how you would be with your children?

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His depths, according to Romans 11.33

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or Daniel 2.2, his depths are unsearchable.

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So how in the world are we going to explore it?

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And that's why we have 1 Corinthians 2.10,

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where it says,

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for God to be revealed, God must be revealed by the Spirit.

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For God to be revealed,

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he must be revealed by the Spirit.

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Why by the Spirit?

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Because according to 1 Corinthians 2.10,

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the Spirit searches all things.

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All things, yes, the deep things of God.

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May I suggest something else that we have to shift in

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over the next little while?

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It'll be a hard shift for me too,

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based on the word that was spoken on Friday.

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One of the things we'll have to shift in is,

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can we become friends of the Holy Spirit

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for the next few months?

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We have a focus on the Father,

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we have a focus on Jesus,

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but not all of us, or not all of us all the time,

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may be as adapted to the Spirit of God

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as we now need to be at this time.

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So let's assume I was Pawan's friend,

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and I want to learn how to canoe.

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And so if I approach Pawan as someone I'm pastoring,

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I won't learn how to canoe.

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If I approach Pawan as my best buddy

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and slap him on his back and stuff like that,

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I won't learn how to canoe.

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So I'm going to learn how to canoe.

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So I'm going to learn how to canoe.

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If I slap him on his back and stuff like that,

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I won't learn how to canoe.

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But if I approach him as one who teaches canoeing,

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then I learn how to canoe.

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It's the same thing when it comes to Father, Son,

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and Holy Spirit.

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There are times when we relate to him as Son and Father,

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there are times when we relate to him as Master and Lord and

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one who's subjected to the Lord.

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And then there are times when we relate

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to the Spirit of God.

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One of the things that may have to happen here

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for the next little while is,

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can we become friends with the Spirit of God?

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In such an odd, intense way,

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that the deep things of God slowly start getting revealed

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to us as a church,

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because it's the job of the Spirit.

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The question is, but if we worship God,

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doesn't it take care of all of it?

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Yes, it does.

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But then there are specific roles

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that the triune God plays.

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There's enough scriptural evidence for it.

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Any questions on that before we move on

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on all these things just said?

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Any questions?

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How do you befriend the Holy Spirit by seeking him out

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and deliberately saying to him

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and then spending time with him as in,

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spending time as in having conversations with him

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and having conversations with Pawan about canoeing,

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not about stuff like other stuff.

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Yeah.

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Vinom's very intentional that this is what I wanted to do.

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So when you wake up, yes,

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you still worship the Father and the Son

00:15:07.780 --> 00:15:08.620
and the Holy Spirit,

00:15:08.620 --> 00:15:10.420
but this idea of Holy Spirit,

00:15:10.420 --> 00:15:11.980
I don't even know how to do this,

00:15:11.980 --> 00:15:14.020
but you're the one who searches the deep things of God.

00:15:14.020 --> 00:15:15.180
Can you begin to show me?

00:15:16.660 --> 00:15:17.500
Because at the end of the day,

00:15:17.500 --> 00:15:19.500
the one who reveals Christ is the Spirit.

00:15:26.620 --> 00:15:27.740
Jesus put it this way.

00:15:28.940 --> 00:15:31.340
I have so much more to tell you,

00:15:31.340 --> 00:15:32.740
but I won't tell you right now,

00:15:32.740 --> 00:15:36.340
or I can't tell you right now because you're not ready.

00:15:36.340 --> 00:15:37.740
But don't worry.

00:15:37.740 --> 00:15:39.540
I'm not leaving you as orphans.

00:15:39.540 --> 00:15:41.620
I'm sending you the Father's Spirit.

00:15:41.620 --> 00:15:43.380
He will take everything of me

00:15:43.380 --> 00:15:44.900
and he will make it known to you

00:15:44.900 --> 00:15:46.460
so that you may know the truth.

00:15:47.420 --> 00:15:50.180
That everything I have, he will make known to you.

00:15:51.460 --> 00:15:55.660
There's almost this deliberate diversion of attention

00:15:55.660 --> 00:15:57.460
that Father, that the Spirit of God,

00:15:57.460 --> 00:15:59.180
that Jesus is doing where he's saying,

00:15:59.180 --> 00:16:01.660
I need you to now divert and listen to

00:16:01.660 --> 00:16:03.500
the third person of the Godhead

00:16:03.500 --> 00:16:04.740
that hasn't come to the earth yet,

00:16:04.740 --> 00:16:07.460
but he is coming and he will lead you into all truth.

00:16:13.020 --> 00:16:15.060
Revealed by the Spirit.

00:16:15.060 --> 00:16:17.340
Sorry, I'll try and write better.

00:16:21.620 --> 00:16:22.740
Any questions, guys?

00:16:22.780 --> 00:16:23.620
Okay.

00:16:27.460 --> 00:16:32.460
If we go after spiritual experiences,

00:16:32.460 --> 00:16:35.860
and I do desire spiritual experiences like crazy,

00:16:35.860 --> 00:16:39.860
spiritual experiences manifest

00:16:42.020 --> 00:16:44.500
but don't convey.

00:16:44.900 --> 00:16:46.300
Manifest,

00:16:48.260 --> 00:16:50.780
but don't convey

00:16:52.820 --> 00:16:54.420
spiritual truths.

00:16:59.460 --> 00:17:01.620
Spiritual experiences, let's say,

00:17:01.620 --> 00:17:03.860
suddenly something hits Emily

00:17:03.860 --> 00:17:06.620
and her neck just instantly becomes fine.

00:17:06.620 --> 00:17:09.380
Or suddenly while we are worshiping,

00:17:09.380 --> 00:17:11.900
people begin to feel the tangible presence of God.

00:17:11.900 --> 00:17:13.260
Spiritual experiences are great.

00:17:13.260 --> 00:17:17.940
They do give evidence of the presence of God manifest,

00:17:17.940 --> 00:17:20.660
but they don't convey spiritual truths.

00:17:20.660 --> 00:17:23.420
Spiritual truths, according to 1 Corinthians 2,

00:17:23.420 --> 00:17:27.180
are only conveyed through it being taught

00:17:27.180 --> 00:17:29.740
and interpreted by the Holy Spirit into your lives,

00:17:29.740 --> 00:17:31.340
imparted by someone.

00:17:32.340 --> 00:17:34.660
It's the only way to learn spiritual truths.

00:17:34.660 --> 00:17:35.820
The Bible says so.

00:17:37.380 --> 00:17:39.740
And what we are after at the end of the day

00:17:39.740 --> 00:17:41.060
is spiritual truth.

00:17:41.060 --> 00:17:42.980
Sorry, go ahead, Nana.

00:17:42.980 --> 00:17:43.820
Yeah.

00:17:44.780 --> 00:17:47.940
Spiritual experiences may manifest the truth,

00:17:47.940 --> 00:17:51.020
as in the truth is Christ heals.

00:17:51.020 --> 00:17:56.020
When suddenly Emily's neck instantly is free from pain,

00:17:56.940 --> 00:17:58.780
that is the truth being manifested.

00:17:59.660 --> 00:18:03.020
But a spiritual experience does not convey the truth.

00:18:03.020 --> 00:18:05.100
The truth is conveyed through teaching.

00:18:05.100 --> 00:18:08.740
Take Isaiah 53, take 2 Peter 2, 23,

00:18:08.740 --> 00:18:11.100
take Psalm 103, verse 5,

00:18:11.140 --> 00:18:13.620
take Malachi 2, verse 1 and 2,

00:18:14.460 --> 00:18:18.380
take Matthew, don't remember.

00:18:18.380 --> 00:18:21.740
And so now you take those verses

00:18:21.740 --> 00:18:23.340
and now the truth is conveyed.

00:18:24.580 --> 00:18:29.300
And so one of the things we have to get a grip of

00:18:29.300 --> 00:18:34.300
in these days that lie ahead is that spiritual truths

00:18:36.820 --> 00:18:40.500
are only conveyed when it is imparted.

00:18:41.780 --> 00:18:46.780
In words that are taught,

00:18:52.180 --> 00:18:53.780
not by human wisdom,

00:18:59.940 --> 00:19:04.940
but taught by the spirit,

00:19:11.260 --> 00:19:16.260
interpreting spiritual truths.

00:19:21.860 --> 00:19:26.020
And it can only be understood by those who are spiritual.

00:19:33.620 --> 00:19:35.500
So it has to be imparted as in,

00:19:35.500 --> 00:19:37.500
it has to be, to impart something

00:19:37.500 --> 00:19:39.060
is to take something and give.

00:19:40.060 --> 00:19:41.260
It has to be imparted.

00:19:43.340 --> 00:19:46.460
And if something is given, it should be received.

00:19:47.500 --> 00:19:50.700
Sometimes the package through which truth comes

00:19:50.700 --> 00:19:53.100
may not be a package to my liking.

00:19:53.100 --> 00:19:55.140
Often I've sat in places where I look at the person

00:19:55.140 --> 00:19:57.580
imparting truth and I think to myself, oh my God.

00:20:00.060 --> 00:20:02.700
But unfortunately God will sometimes humble me

00:20:02.700 --> 00:20:05.780
by bringing truth through a package that I do not like.

00:20:09.260 --> 00:20:11.500
So it's imparted.

00:20:11.500 --> 00:20:12.940
It's imparted in words.

00:20:12.940 --> 00:20:14.060
It has to be taught.

00:20:17.300 --> 00:20:20.300
Are you saying that we only receive teaching

00:20:23.500 --> 00:20:26.300
through by the spirit but through another person?

00:20:28.780 --> 00:20:33.780
Yes, because in Ephesians 4, verse 11 onwards,

00:20:34.260 --> 00:20:37.460
it says that God has given to the church,

00:20:37.500 --> 00:20:39.500
apostles, prophets, teachers, evangelists, and pastors

00:20:39.500 --> 00:20:40.340
for what?

00:20:40.340 --> 00:20:43.140
For the equipping of saints for the work of ministry.

00:20:43.140 --> 00:20:45.780
Does that mean that the spirit cannot teach you a truth?

00:20:45.780 --> 00:20:48.020
No, because even the teachers must be learning it

00:20:48.020 --> 00:20:50.620
from somewhere to be able to impart it to you.

00:20:50.620 --> 00:20:53.020
But is it one of the essential ways

00:20:53.020 --> 00:20:55.460
in the context of the body that it happens?

00:20:55.460 --> 00:20:56.540
Yes.

00:20:56.540 --> 00:20:59.540
What are the four main pillars of a church?

00:20:59.540 --> 00:21:01.500
Apostolic, doctrine.

00:21:02.380 --> 00:21:03.260
What is that?

00:21:03.260 --> 00:21:05.780
A common set of teachings.

00:21:08.460 --> 00:21:10.340
The anointing in us will teach us,

00:21:10.340 --> 00:21:14.340
as in the spirit of God in us will show us the truth,

00:21:14.340 --> 00:21:16.500
will show us revelations from the word.

00:21:16.500 --> 00:21:19.700
But at the end of the day, if that was enough,

00:21:19.700 --> 00:21:23.300
then Ephesians 4, 11 to 17 never needed to be written

00:21:23.300 --> 00:21:25.540
because we don't need anybody else

00:21:25.540 --> 00:21:27.140
but the anointing of the spirit.

00:21:29.340 --> 00:21:30.820
And it doesn't work that way.

00:21:30.820 --> 00:21:32.620
It'll never work that way.

00:21:32.620 --> 00:21:36.020
I'll always have to be dependent on someone else

00:21:36.020 --> 00:21:37.740
to get to a place where I need to.

00:21:39.340 --> 00:21:42.500
And yet, it is not exclusive to the point

00:21:42.500 --> 00:21:43.620
you can't learn by yourself

00:21:43.620 --> 00:21:44.820
because the spirit of God won't show you.

00:21:44.820 --> 00:21:46.380
No, he will show you.

00:21:46.380 --> 00:21:49.340
But without verification, without being taught,

00:21:49.340 --> 00:21:50.180
not possible.

00:21:53.380 --> 00:21:54.940
That is why we need to distinguish

00:21:54.940 --> 00:21:57.700
between true teachers and false teachers.

00:21:57.700 --> 00:21:59.540
Why are there falsehoods in the world today,

00:21:59.540 --> 00:22:00.380
in churches today?

00:22:00.380 --> 00:22:02.860
Because there are also false teachers.

00:22:03.300 --> 00:22:05.500
Which then means that a teaching from the Bible

00:22:05.500 --> 00:22:08.220
can be taken and distorted to a point

00:22:08.220 --> 00:22:10.660
where it becomes false.

00:22:13.780 --> 00:22:15.940
And therefore, it has to be imparted in words

00:22:15.940 --> 00:22:18.460
that were taught not by human wisdom

00:22:19.820 --> 00:22:21.460
but taught by the spirit.

00:22:21.460 --> 00:22:24.620
And it has to be interpreted by the spirit to us.

00:22:25.900 --> 00:22:26.940
And the more we learn,

00:22:26.940 --> 00:22:29.500
the more we can hold a plumb line against the truth.

00:22:29.500 --> 00:22:30.620
That's the other thing.

00:22:30.900 --> 00:22:32.020
That's the other thing.

00:22:32.020 --> 00:22:33.220
The more you learn,

00:22:33.220 --> 00:22:35.980
the more you can hold a plumb line against the truth.

00:22:36.860 --> 00:22:38.820
The less I'm receptive to learning,

00:22:38.820 --> 00:22:42.220
the less chance there is of my ability

00:22:42.220 --> 00:22:44.780
to discern between true and false.

00:22:48.940 --> 00:22:51.620
When you do that first one, 237.

00:22:51.620 --> 00:22:53.740
Which is what I kind of quoted.

00:22:53.740 --> 00:22:55.740
As for you, the anointing you received

00:22:55.740 --> 00:22:56.940
from the remains of you.

00:22:56.940 --> 00:22:57.780
Yeah.

00:22:57.780 --> 00:22:58.780
You don't have anyone to teach you.

00:22:58.780 --> 00:22:59.620
Yeah.

00:22:59.620 --> 00:23:01.820
The anointing teaches you about all things.

00:23:01.820 --> 00:23:02.660
Yeah.

00:23:02.660 --> 00:23:04.300
And it is real, not counterfeit.

00:23:04.300 --> 00:23:05.140
Yeah.

00:23:05.140 --> 00:23:06.540
Just as it has taught you to make it.

00:23:06.540 --> 00:23:08.380
Yeah, so that's exactly what I quoted.

00:23:08.380 --> 00:23:10.740
Saying the anointing in you teaches you.

00:23:10.740 --> 00:23:13.820
And then there are teachers who bring it in.

00:23:13.820 --> 00:23:16.820
Because what if you are not receptive to the anointing?

00:23:19.180 --> 00:23:21.020
What if the anointing in you

00:23:21.020 --> 00:23:22.340
is something you're not responding to?

00:23:22.340 --> 00:23:25.540
What if, look at this, Paul was anointed, right?

00:23:25.540 --> 00:23:26.860
What did he do when he heard truths

00:23:26.860 --> 00:23:28.420
about God in the desert?

00:23:28.420 --> 00:23:29.260
What did he do?

00:23:29.900 --> 00:23:32.180
He sent immediately to the apostles in Jerusalem.

00:23:32.180 --> 00:23:33.020
Why?

00:23:33.020 --> 00:23:36.300
Because he wanted to verify what he had been taught.

00:23:36.300 --> 00:23:38.300
So it's not one or the other, it is both.

00:23:38.300 --> 00:23:42.900
But he cannot do without being taught

00:23:42.900 --> 00:23:45.140
or without words of teaching being imparted.

00:23:48.540 --> 00:23:51.460
Can your child learn the letters of the alphabet

00:23:51.460 --> 00:23:53.300
by himself or herself?

00:23:53.300 --> 00:23:54.140
Yeah.

00:23:54.140 --> 00:23:55.300
If you help a little.

00:23:56.140 --> 00:24:01.140
But can he spell big words like Sheldon Lou?

00:24:01.820 --> 00:24:02.660
No.

00:24:13.140 --> 00:24:14.940
So let me touch on the last one.

00:24:14.940 --> 00:24:17.020
By those who are spiritual.

00:24:17.020 --> 00:24:19.060
So the question is, are you spiritual?

00:24:20.700 --> 00:24:23.100
And your immediate response will be,

00:24:23.100 --> 00:24:24.340
how do you know if you're spiritual?

00:24:24.340 --> 00:24:25.580
Sede would ask that.

00:24:25.580 --> 00:24:27.060
So before Sede asks that.

00:24:30.860 --> 00:24:32.100
Are you spiritual?

00:24:33.140 --> 00:24:33.980
That's the question.

00:24:33.980 --> 00:24:36.140
Because if you are not spiritual,

00:24:36.140 --> 00:24:39.180
do not expect to understand spiritual truths

00:24:39.180 --> 00:24:41.100
by the Holy Spirit.

00:24:41.100 --> 00:24:41.920
It's crazy.

00:24:41.920 --> 00:24:45.580
These are such difficult things for us

00:24:45.580 --> 00:24:48.580
as independent Christians sometimes to accept

00:24:48.580 --> 00:24:50.540
that I have to be spiritual

00:24:50.540 --> 00:24:53.620
to understand spiritual truths from the Holy Spirit.

00:24:54.740 --> 00:24:56.700
Nobody wants this.

00:24:57.780 --> 00:25:01.420
We don't realize how highly individualized we are.

00:25:01.420 --> 00:25:06.420
Where everything has to be my decision, my choice,

00:25:07.100 --> 00:25:09.140
my choosing, my selection.

00:25:09.140 --> 00:25:10.820
And it is a falsehood.

00:25:16.860 --> 00:25:20.060
Spiritual truths are understood by spiritual people.

00:25:20.060 --> 00:25:22.020
So the question is, are you spiritual?

00:25:23.020 --> 00:25:26.580
And the second question is, if you say you're spiritual,

00:25:26.580 --> 00:25:28.500
who are you spiritual with?

00:25:33.020 --> 00:25:33.860
Exactly.

00:25:35.300 --> 00:25:37.860
If I say I'm spiritual, your next question should be,

00:25:37.860 --> 00:25:40.140
Jacob, who are you spiritual with?

00:25:40.140 --> 00:25:42.940
As in, who are you interacting with

00:25:42.940 --> 00:25:46.540
where they are able to experience the fruit

00:25:46.540 --> 00:25:49.140
and the gifts of the Spirit active in you

00:25:49.140 --> 00:25:50.540
because Christ lives in you?

00:25:53.020 --> 00:25:54.420
Who are you spiritual with?

00:25:58.500 --> 00:26:03.500
Spirituality can never be weighed in isolation.

00:26:03.900 --> 00:26:06.300
Spirituality, every fruit of the Spirit

00:26:06.300 --> 00:26:10.140
only happens in the context of others.

00:26:12.420 --> 00:26:13.500
Not in isolation.

00:26:16.460 --> 00:26:18.020
So how do you define spiritual?

00:26:19.100 --> 00:26:21.860
You would define spiritual as the ways of Christ

00:26:22.700 --> 00:26:27.700
being first developed in you and then expressed through you

00:26:27.740 --> 00:26:32.540
in the context of a people to whom it becomes evident

00:26:32.540 --> 00:26:35.340
that the Son is both being formed in you

00:26:35.340 --> 00:26:36.900
and being displayed through you.

00:26:38.780 --> 00:26:40.740
Want me to repeat that?

00:26:40.740 --> 00:26:45.340
To be spiritual is to, on one hand,

00:26:48.500 --> 00:26:50.060
shoot, I forgot the whole line.

00:26:52.540 --> 00:26:57.540
Yeah, to be spiritual is to have the ways of Christ

00:26:57.620 --> 00:27:01.740
increasingly develop in you so that the Son

00:27:01.740 --> 00:27:06.100
is both formed in you and expresses himself through you

00:27:06.100 --> 00:27:10.060
in the context of a people so that they can see

00:27:10.060 --> 00:27:11.940
the evidence of Christ in you.

00:27:11.940 --> 00:27:13.380
That is when you're spiritual.

00:27:13.380 --> 00:27:14.700
And you cannot do this on your own.

00:27:14.700 --> 00:27:17.660
If I develop myself spiritually on my own,

00:27:17.660 --> 00:27:19.020
it is not spiritual.

00:27:19.620 --> 00:27:22.420
To be spiritual is to be spiritual with someone.

00:27:23.860 --> 00:27:25.060
That's the measure of it.

00:27:29.140 --> 00:27:30.220
Any questions?

00:27:44.060 --> 00:27:45.860
It's only in the context of others,

00:27:46.700 --> 00:27:50.180
only in the context of others, that you can be fruitful.

00:27:52.580 --> 00:27:54.860
Trees never bear fruit for themselves.

00:27:54.860 --> 00:27:57.180
Trees bear fruit so that they may either

00:27:57.180 --> 00:28:00.500
have the fruit plucked by people or trees bear fruit

00:28:00.500 --> 00:28:02.780
so that the fruit may lead to more seeds

00:28:02.780 --> 00:28:05.180
that will produce more trees.

00:28:05.180 --> 00:28:06.780
It is never for oneself.

00:28:11.380 --> 00:28:13.780
So to be spiritual again, another way of,

00:28:14.320 --> 00:28:18.040
spiritual growth is directly proportional to fruitfulness.

00:28:22.040 --> 00:28:25.380
Spiritual growth is directly proportional to fruitfulness.

00:28:25.380 --> 00:28:28.940
Spiritual growth is directly proportional to fruitfulness.

00:28:30.620 --> 00:28:33.700
Virtual growth is directly proportional to fruitfulness

00:28:35.740 --> 00:28:40.780
and it benefits both the wine

00:28:40.780 --> 00:28:54.860
both the wine as in Christ and the branches on the tree as in the rest of the people.

00:28:54.860 --> 00:29:03.900
So that's one way you can evaluate spiritual, what the word spiritual means.

00:29:03.900 --> 00:29:24.900
And if you are doing well in this then expect to know spiritual truths that the Spirit of God will show you in the season ahead.

00:29:33.900 --> 00:29:47.900
Let's just take one verse and go as far as we can for another 20 minutes and then we'll stop.

00:29:47.900 --> 00:29:52.900
John 15 verse 7 and 8, let's just take those two verses and look at them.

00:29:52.900 --> 00:29:59.900
John 15 verse 7 and 8, here's what it says.

00:29:59.900 --> 00:30:09.900
John 15 verse 7 and 8, if you abide in me.

00:30:09.900 --> 00:30:15.900
Sometimes it's good for the house churches that you attend, for the leaders to have a one-on-one with you,

00:30:15.900 --> 00:30:27.900
to not tell you whether you're spiritual or not but to have a conversation with you on how you are doing with being spiritual.

00:30:27.900 --> 00:30:31.900
To sit with Jill, if I were a house church leader and ask her,

00:30:31.900 --> 00:30:37.900
so Jill, tell me, how do you think you are doing with being spiritual?

00:30:37.900 --> 00:30:48.900
And if she says well, then I'll say why do you say so?

00:30:48.900 --> 00:30:54.900
And the same way for Derek or me to come and sit with me and say, are you being spiritual Jacob?

00:30:54.900 --> 00:31:07.900
And if I say, we are really, really spiritual, the next question is, so why do you say so?

00:31:07.900 --> 00:31:10.900
One-on-othering in a church includes this.

00:31:10.900 --> 00:31:22.900
One-on-othering is spurring each other to good works, stirring each other up, admonishing each other.

00:31:22.900 --> 00:31:32.900
And at this stage in our lives, that surgical scalpel must be used so that circumcision is complete.

00:31:32.900 --> 00:31:35.900
And it is painful.

00:31:35.900 --> 00:31:42.900
We'll walk like John Wayne for a while, but then it'll be okay.

00:31:42.900 --> 00:31:45.900
So, sorry.

00:31:45.900 --> 00:31:49.900
I was just going about being spiritual in the context of others.

00:31:49.900 --> 00:31:55.900
Would you consider non-believers as well?

00:31:55.900 --> 00:31:57.900
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

00:31:57.900 --> 00:32:05.900
I think, yeah, because most of our engagement is with ones who are not believers, right?

00:32:05.900 --> 00:32:09.900
So, yeah, absolutely.

00:32:09.900 --> 00:32:11.900
Yeah, it's an important point.

00:32:11.900 --> 00:32:19.900
It's very easy to think that being spiritual is what we do for two hours here or attending a house church.

00:32:19.900 --> 00:32:28.900
You can attend a house church and spend three hours here and you'd be completely not spiritual when you live 24-7 out there in the world.

00:32:28.900 --> 00:32:32.900
But remember, the stones are cut in the quarry.

00:32:32.900 --> 00:32:37.900
This is the quarry and this is where one should see if a stone is cut properly.

00:32:37.900 --> 00:32:43.900
Otherwise, the stone cannot be used for building because you don't know what kind of stone you're using out there.

00:32:43.900 --> 00:32:46.900
The church is a pillar and the foundation of truth.

00:32:46.900 --> 00:32:48.900
Here is where the measurement takes place.

00:32:48.900 --> 00:33:04.900
And to refuse to be measured is to disqualify yourself.

00:33:04.900 --> 00:33:06.900
Can I tell you something?

00:33:06.900 --> 00:33:09.900
I'm not rich to teach and preach like this, guys.

00:33:09.900 --> 00:33:10.900
You should try it.

00:33:10.900 --> 00:33:16.900
It's not easy.

00:33:16.900 --> 00:33:20.900
Yeah, yeah, it is not easy.

00:33:20.900 --> 00:33:26.900
It is not easy.

00:33:26.900 --> 00:33:28.900
It is not easy.

00:33:28.900 --> 00:33:34.900
I'm not saying it for applause, but I want you to know this is difficult.

00:33:34.900 --> 00:33:48.900
But I cannot but do this because I will be held responsible for your life.

00:33:48.900 --> 00:33:53.900
Because sometimes when I teach like this, I think to myself, my God, man, move on.

00:33:53.900 --> 00:34:03.900
Go to something happy and it will be so much easier.

00:34:03.900 --> 00:34:09.900
John 15, 7 to 8.

00:34:09.900 --> 00:34:14.900
If you abide in me, another word for abide in thee and I will remain.

00:34:14.900 --> 00:34:30.900
If you abide in me and my words abide in you and my words abide or remain in you, depending on the version.

00:34:30.900 --> 00:34:37.900
Ask whatever you want.

00:34:37.900 --> 00:34:47.900
And it will be done for you.

00:34:47.900 --> 00:34:58.900
Crazy, eh?

00:34:58.900 --> 00:35:05.900
This is to my Father's glory.

00:35:05.900 --> 00:35:11.900
This is to my Father's glory.

00:35:11.900 --> 00:35:18.900
That you bear much fruit.

00:35:18.900 --> 00:35:23.900
That you bear much fruit.

00:35:23.900 --> 00:35:39.900
Showing yourself to be my disciples.

00:35:39.900 --> 00:35:46.900
Crazy, man. What a scripture.

00:35:46.900 --> 00:35:55.900
If you abide in me or remain in me and my words abide or remain in you, ask whatever you want.

00:35:55.900 --> 00:35:59.900
These are places that God wants to take us.

00:35:59.900 --> 00:36:03.900
He wants actually to do this with any group of believers.

00:36:03.900 --> 00:36:10.900
But He's definitely saying to us, these are places I want to take you.

00:36:10.900 --> 00:36:19.900
No, one or two of us. He's so not interested in one or two or some super person or some great guy.

00:36:19.900 --> 00:36:26.900
No, He prefers a group. He's always wanted a nation.

00:36:26.900 --> 00:36:33.900
If you abide in me and my words abide in you, ask whatever you want and it will be done for you.

00:36:33.900 --> 00:36:36.900
This is to my Father's glory.

00:36:36.900 --> 00:36:38.900
That you bear much fruit.

00:36:38.900 --> 00:36:46.900
And if you bear much fruit, know this, that you will show yourself as my disciples.

00:36:46.900 --> 00:36:53.900
Just want to look at this verse and then we'll end.

00:36:53.900 --> 00:37:07.900
Another word for abiding, guys, is believing trust.

00:37:07.900 --> 00:37:14.900
Believing trust or attachment.

00:37:14.900 --> 00:37:22.900
You are willing to attach yourself to someone because you absolutely believe what they've said and you trust them.

00:37:22.900 --> 00:37:31.900
And you're absolutely attached.

00:37:31.900 --> 00:37:36.900
It is relational.

00:37:36.900 --> 00:37:42.900
It is intimate.

00:37:42.900 --> 00:37:45.900
I dislike using this word and so I'll explain it.

00:37:45.900 --> 00:37:48.900
It's organic.

00:37:48.900 --> 00:37:50.900
I have a high suspicion of anything that's organic.

00:37:50.900 --> 00:37:56.900
It is totally dependent.

00:37:56.900 --> 00:37:59.900
Because the moment you say organic, it depends on who the person is.

00:37:59.900 --> 00:38:02.900
When I think of the word organic, I think tasteless.

00:38:02.900 --> 00:38:07.900
But that's why I struggle with the word.

00:38:07.900 --> 00:38:08.900
But it's a good word.

00:38:08.900 --> 00:38:13.900
So when I say organic, what I mean is it is homegrown.

00:38:13.900 --> 00:38:17.900
It is not foreign. It's not mixed.

00:38:17.900 --> 00:38:22.900
It's something that is very true about it.

00:38:22.900 --> 00:38:26.900
And it's tasty.

00:38:26.900 --> 00:38:35.900
So when God says, hey, abide in my presence, I want you to remain in my presence.

00:38:35.900 --> 00:38:37.900
So I want you to make yourself home in my presence.

00:38:37.900 --> 00:38:40.900
All these are words that different versions use.

00:38:40.900 --> 00:38:41.900
Come remain in my presence.

00:38:41.900 --> 00:38:43.900
Come dwell in my presence.

00:38:43.900 --> 00:38:45.900
Come abide in my presence.

00:38:45.900 --> 00:38:48.900
Come make yourself home in my presence.

00:38:48.900 --> 00:38:50.900
All these are words that he uses.

00:38:50.900 --> 00:38:55.900
And he says, what I mean by that is can you attach yourself because you just believe me blind.

00:38:55.900 --> 00:38:59.900
You believe me blind.

00:38:59.900 --> 00:39:02.900
It doesn't matter what I say.

00:39:02.900 --> 00:39:06.900
You just believe me blind because you trust me absolutely.

00:39:06.900 --> 00:39:09.900
But why do you trust me absolutely?

00:39:09.900 --> 00:39:13.900
Because over a period of time, you have learned to be relational.

00:39:13.900 --> 00:39:15.900
You have learned to be intimate.

00:39:15.900 --> 00:39:21.900
You have learned to be real with me, true, without mixture.

00:39:21.900 --> 00:39:27.900
And you have learned to be totally helplessly abandoned in dependence.

00:39:27.900 --> 00:39:30.900
That is the desire God has for all of us.

00:39:30.900 --> 00:39:35.900
That is the desire he had for man.

00:39:35.900 --> 00:39:41.900
That is definitely the desire he has for us.

00:39:41.900 --> 00:39:45.900
Every day I attempt at least two minutes of this.

00:39:45.900 --> 00:39:48.900
Two minutes of this.

00:39:48.900 --> 00:39:51.900
Two minutes of this.

00:39:51.900 --> 00:39:59.900
Four minutes, an hour.

00:39:59.900 --> 00:40:09.900
Possible man. It is possible.

00:40:09.900 --> 00:40:12.900
When you abide like this, a strange thing begins to happen.

00:40:12.900 --> 00:40:31.900
Abiding causes things to flow from God to you.

00:40:31.900 --> 00:40:37.900
It permeates.

00:40:37.900 --> 00:40:41.900
And then it is up to you whether you receive it or not.

00:40:41.900 --> 00:40:51.900
But it will flow.

00:40:51.900 --> 00:40:53.900
Abiding causes things to flow from.

00:40:53.900 --> 00:40:56.900
This is why Jesus takes a vine and the branches and says,

00:40:56.900 --> 00:41:01.900
Hey, apart from me, a branch will be dead wood and it will be tossed into the fire.

00:41:01.900 --> 00:41:04.900
But stay attached to me and things will flow.

00:41:04.900 --> 00:41:07.900
What are the three things he says will flow?

00:41:07.900 --> 00:41:12.900
When you read John 15, 6-12, the three things he says will flow.

00:41:12.900 --> 00:41:21.900
And this is why, guys, this is why it is so important for the devil to cause us not to abide.

00:41:21.900 --> 00:41:23.900
He will cause us to pray.

00:41:23.900 --> 00:41:25.900
He will cause us to have quiet time.

00:41:25.900 --> 00:41:29.900
He will allow us to spend two hours together like this.

00:41:29.900 --> 00:41:35.900
But the one thing he vehemently, violently opposes is actual abiding.

00:41:35.900 --> 00:41:41.900
Because when one abides, things from God begin to flow into you.

00:41:41.900 --> 00:41:45.900
And that cannot be allowed.

00:41:45.900 --> 00:41:50.900
It's effortless. The flowing becomes effortless.

00:41:50.900 --> 00:41:58.900
It cannot be allowed.

00:41:58.900 --> 00:42:01.900
The flesh dissolves when abiding begins.

00:42:01.900 --> 00:42:10.900
As in this flesh no longer prevents God from having all of you.

00:42:10.900 --> 00:42:21.900
I found out by mistake that if you leave a garbage bag full of stuff on the floor long enough, it flows.

00:42:21.900 --> 00:42:26.900
I put two garbage bags, but it flowed.

00:42:26.900 --> 00:42:38.900
It doesn't matter whether it's good stuff or bad stuff.

00:42:38.900 --> 00:42:42.900
These are the things we desperately need at a time such as this.

00:42:42.900 --> 00:42:52.900
All of us.

00:42:52.900 --> 00:42:55.900
Abiding must come first.

00:42:55.900 --> 00:43:02.900
Or if it doesn't come first, pray that it comes first.

00:43:02.900 --> 00:43:12.900
It is impossible to abide in the presence of God without obeying the word.

00:43:12.900 --> 00:43:17.900
One of the first requirements for abiding is obedience to the word.

00:43:17.900 --> 00:43:23.900
So because there is a tendency today in the charismatic world to soak in the presence,

00:43:23.900 --> 00:43:47.900
one of the things that we forget is there is no abiding or dwelling if there is no obedience.

00:43:47.900 --> 00:43:51.900
What do you mean no obedience? I am obedient.

00:43:51.900 --> 00:44:16.900
See the areas of struggle, resistance, delay, stubbornness, unwillingness.

00:44:21.900 --> 00:44:38.900
And you will and I will know where I need to be.

00:44:38.900 --> 00:44:41.900
That begins the process. I'm just talking about recognizing it.

00:44:41.900 --> 00:44:45.900
There is no abiding, no dwelling if there is no obedience.

00:44:45.900 --> 00:44:49.900
That's the first area.

00:44:49.900 --> 00:44:52.900
Look at the areas of my life where I struggle with obedience,

00:44:52.900 --> 00:44:56.900
where there is a resistance to obedience, where there is a delay in obedience,

00:44:56.900 --> 00:45:00.900
where there is stubbornness to obedience, where there is an unwillingness to obey.

00:45:00.900 --> 00:45:03.900
And in looking at that I will know.

00:45:03.900 --> 00:45:06.900
So many areas that still need to change.

00:45:06.900 --> 00:45:08.900
And that's just a recognition.

00:45:08.900 --> 00:45:12.900
Sometimes all God needs is a recognition.

00:45:12.900 --> 00:45:15.900
Okay, sorry, go ahead.

00:45:15.900 --> 00:45:24.900
I was just going to say, so how do you go into naval gazing?

00:45:24.900 --> 00:45:35.900
Yeah, how do you not go into naval gazing?

00:45:35.900 --> 00:45:39.900
Naval gazing is only a problem when guilt and condemnation kick in.

00:45:39.900 --> 00:45:41.900
If I can do this without...

00:45:41.900 --> 00:45:45.900
Naval gazing is basically looking at your belly button.

00:45:45.900 --> 00:45:52.900
But what Dylan and I mean by that is that when we begin to focus on the,

00:45:52.900 --> 00:45:58.900
oh, woe is me, I am sinful, I am this, I am that, then it becomes a problem.

00:45:58.900 --> 00:46:11.900
So naval gazing is okay as long as you sidestep the minefield of guilt and condemnation.

00:46:11.900 --> 00:46:14.900
Because there are two extremes in Christianity.

00:46:14.900 --> 00:46:21.900
One that says naval gazing is wrong because we have been positionally made righteous.

00:46:21.900 --> 00:46:24.900
So we don't need to naval gaze at all.

00:46:24.900 --> 00:46:29.900
And then there's the other side which says naval gazing is absolutely required

00:46:29.900 --> 00:46:32.900
because otherwise you will live immoral lives.

00:46:32.900 --> 00:46:34.900
So you're a sinful man.

00:46:34.900 --> 00:46:37.900
At the end of the day, it's not one or the other.

00:46:37.900 --> 00:46:41.900
It is knowing that, yeah, I've got problems in this area,

00:46:41.900 --> 00:46:45.900
but I will refuse to come under guilt and condemnation

00:46:45.900 --> 00:46:50.900
because I operate from the position of a man who is forgiven and restored,

00:46:50.900 --> 00:46:53.900
who is struggling with areas in my life.

00:46:53.900 --> 00:46:56.900
It's a hard thing to fit in one equation.

00:46:56.900 --> 00:47:02.900
Isn't it also allowing the Holy Spirit to direct which part he wants to deal with?

00:47:02.900 --> 00:47:06.900
Because he doesn't always deal with everything at the same time.

00:47:06.900 --> 00:47:09.900
Or sometimes we think, well, why don't you deal with this?

00:47:09.900 --> 00:47:13.900
This is a big issue and I think this is most important,

00:47:13.900 --> 00:47:16.900
but he's like, no, this thing over here.

00:47:16.900 --> 00:47:17.900
Agreed.

00:47:17.900 --> 00:47:19.900
Here's the catch though.

00:47:19.900 --> 00:47:22.900
What if the Holy Spirit uses me to point out something in you?

00:47:22.900 --> 00:47:24.900
That's where the struggle comes in.

00:47:24.900 --> 00:47:27.900
As long as the Holy Spirit is dealing directly with me to show me my sin,

00:47:27.900 --> 00:47:29.900
Jim, I can handle it.

00:47:29.900 --> 00:47:31.900
The Holy Spirit and me are good.

00:47:31.900 --> 00:47:34.900
But when you come and you put your finger on something,

00:47:34.900 --> 00:47:37.900
now it begins to create a problem.

00:47:37.900 --> 00:47:40.900
If I'm open to both, the Spirit of God showing me stuff

00:47:40.900 --> 00:47:43.900
and you showing me stuff, I'm a rich man.

00:47:46.900 --> 00:47:49.900
This is why hostage leaders over the next little while

00:47:49.900 --> 00:47:52.900
should sit and use a scalpel.

00:47:56.900 --> 00:47:59.900
It is fault-finding so that you may be corrected.

00:47:59.900 --> 00:48:02.900
Does a parent find fault with their children?

00:48:10.900 --> 00:48:11.900
Nope.

00:48:11.900 --> 00:48:13.900
It is raising up children.

00:48:13.900 --> 00:48:16.900
If I don't find things that are wrong with you,

00:48:16.900 --> 00:48:21.900
you will not be able to walk the way you're supposed to.

00:48:21.900 --> 00:48:25.900
If you don't find fault with me or the ones that look into my life

00:48:25.900 --> 00:48:28.900
and point out things, I will not change.

00:48:29.900 --> 00:48:33.900
Remember, blind spots, we are specialized in.

00:48:33.900 --> 00:48:36.900
Blind spots are things that you don't know you're doing.

00:48:37.900 --> 00:48:40.900
Someone told me recently that whenever I start thinking,

00:48:40.900 --> 00:48:42.900
I start rubbing my head here,

00:48:42.900 --> 00:48:45.900
and I believe there's a groove in the back of my head now.

00:48:45.900 --> 00:48:47.900
So here's another...

00:48:47.900 --> 00:48:48.900
Okay.

00:48:48.900 --> 00:48:51.900
So your house church leader who sees you once every two weeks

00:48:51.900 --> 00:48:53.900
is not going to have a clue about...

00:48:53.900 --> 00:48:54.900
Aha!

00:48:54.900 --> 00:48:56.900
What about the Holy Spirit now?

00:48:57.900 --> 00:48:59.900
So he can speak to them but not to me?

00:48:59.900 --> 00:49:01.900
He can speak to them and not to you.

00:49:01.900 --> 00:49:02.900
Yes.

00:49:02.900 --> 00:49:05.900
And then there are times when he'll speak to you and not to them.

00:49:05.900 --> 00:49:07.900
The trick is to be open to both.

00:49:07.900 --> 00:49:09.900
But he's going to...

00:49:09.900 --> 00:49:11.900
If I have an area of sin in my life,

00:49:11.900 --> 00:49:14.900
because you believe you would be dealing with it...

00:49:14.900 --> 00:49:17.900
And what if you don't hear and you're oblivious to it?

00:49:17.900 --> 00:49:19.900
You think it hasn't happened in my life?

00:49:19.900 --> 00:49:21.900
Where there was sin in my life and I didn't see it?

00:49:21.900 --> 00:49:23.900
It's happened to everybody here, including you.

00:49:23.900 --> 00:49:26.900
There is not a single person here who was sinning,

00:49:26.900 --> 00:49:29.900
knew they were sinning, and yet did not do anything about it

00:49:29.900 --> 00:49:32.900
until someone, not once or twice or three times,

00:49:32.900 --> 00:49:34.900
pointed it out multiple times.

00:49:34.900 --> 00:49:37.900
I guess what I was struggling with is...

00:49:37.900 --> 00:49:39.900
It just feels like control.

00:49:40.900 --> 00:49:43.900
It is one way to see it, that this is controlling.

00:49:43.900 --> 00:49:45.900
The other way to see it is,

00:49:45.900 --> 00:49:48.900
aha, there is someone who's interested in me who's correcting me.

00:49:48.900 --> 00:49:51.900
But there's... Yeah, I guess there's...

00:49:51.900 --> 00:49:53.900
Yeah, we can take it offline.

00:49:53.900 --> 00:49:57.900
But guys, this is the pressure or demand that will be placed on us

00:49:57.900 --> 00:50:00.900
if we're operating in the context we're operating in.

00:50:02.900 --> 00:50:06.900
A fine line, but it will be held.

00:50:09.900 --> 00:50:13.900
Sometimes, yeah, if it's done with a heart of love,

00:50:13.900 --> 00:50:16.900
because sometimes even the way you receive it

00:50:16.900 --> 00:50:19.900
may not be the way you should receive it.

00:50:21.900 --> 00:50:25.900
You think children think that parents don't have a good book and a bad book?

00:50:25.900 --> 00:50:27.900
One of the things I get told often is,

00:50:27.900 --> 00:50:29.900
oh, you have a good book and a bad book.

00:50:29.900 --> 00:50:31.900
You think when your child...

00:50:31.900 --> 00:50:33.900
I was asking a parent just yesterday,

00:50:33.900 --> 00:50:35.900
when your child doesn't do well,

00:50:35.900 --> 00:50:37.900
do they feel particularly in your good books?

00:50:37.900 --> 00:50:39.900
No, they don't feel in your good books.

00:50:39.900 --> 00:50:41.900
What do you feel about them?

00:50:41.900 --> 00:50:44.900
That they are your son and daughter, you would do anything for them.

00:50:46.900 --> 00:50:49.900
We are building a house,

00:50:49.900 --> 00:50:52.900
not a church, not an institution.

00:50:52.900 --> 00:50:54.900
People have to be raised.

00:50:56.900 --> 00:50:59.900
So it also talks about speaking truth and love.

00:50:59.900 --> 00:51:01.900
And if you have...

00:51:01.900 --> 00:51:03.900
Like, you can have love without truth and that's not love.

00:51:03.900 --> 00:51:05.900
You can have truth without love,

00:51:05.900 --> 00:51:07.900
but that's not truth.

00:51:11.900 --> 00:51:13.900
Oh, no.

00:51:13.900 --> 00:51:17.900
The reason I'm stopping and parking here is because this is important.

00:51:17.900 --> 00:51:20.900
I can easily say, Jill, we can talk about this later.

00:51:20.900 --> 00:51:23.900
But I refuse to, because this is important.

00:51:23.900 --> 00:51:25.900
This is where we are going.

00:51:25.900 --> 00:51:27.900
We've got to be clear about this, eh?

00:51:27.900 --> 00:51:31.900
We don't want to grow without knowing that these are the lines that are established.

00:51:35.900 --> 00:51:43.900
My leaders misperceive you in their own biases.

00:51:43.900 --> 00:51:46.900
Yeah, then if leaders misperceive you in your biases,

00:51:46.900 --> 00:51:48.900
come and talk to the main leader.

00:51:49.900 --> 00:51:51.900
Who's the main leader?

00:51:51.900 --> 00:51:53.900
Yeah.

00:51:53.900 --> 00:51:55.900
Come and talk to the main leader.

00:51:55.900 --> 00:51:58.900
Tell him that I'm being perceived with a bias.

00:51:59.900 --> 00:52:01.900
And if you don't trust the main leader,

00:52:01.900 --> 00:52:04.900
then my simple question is, find someone else.

00:52:04.900 --> 00:52:06.900
And if you don't trust anybody, then the simple question is,

00:52:06.900 --> 00:52:08.900
what are you doing here?

00:52:22.900 --> 00:52:24.900
And sometimes it's difficult.

00:52:24.900 --> 00:52:26.900
Sometimes for you to, if I'm misjudging you,

00:52:26.900 --> 00:52:28.900
it's very difficult for you to come and say,

00:52:28.900 --> 00:52:30.900
you're misjudging me and have that conversation.

00:52:30.900 --> 00:52:32.900
Because it's not easy.

00:52:32.900 --> 00:52:37.900
Find someone like a derrick who seems relatively, at least appears relatively harmless.

00:52:39.900 --> 00:52:40.900
Pardon?

00:52:40.900 --> 00:52:44.900
Find another leader and come bring, if I can't be approached,

00:52:44.900 --> 00:52:46.900
find another leader.

00:52:46.900 --> 00:52:48.900
Eventually the word will get to me.

00:52:49.900 --> 00:52:52.900
And I'll try to do it as well as possible.

00:52:53.900 --> 00:52:58.900
And there will be times where it will be impossible for you to reconcile,

00:52:58.900 --> 00:53:02.900
in which case, find a place where you will grow well.

00:53:10.900 --> 00:53:16.900
Yeah. So if you're misjudged, that would be the way to go about it.

00:53:18.900 --> 00:53:22.900
You can come and say, I'm being misjudged by Derrick.

00:53:23.900 --> 00:53:24.900
No, no, not right now.

00:53:24.900 --> 00:53:27.900
No, there's a limit to what we can do on video.

00:53:28.900 --> 00:53:29.900
Yeah.

00:53:30.900 --> 00:53:31.900
Not right now.

00:53:31.900 --> 00:53:33.900
But you can come and tell me I'm being misjudged here.

00:53:33.900 --> 00:53:35.900
And then we can talk about it.

00:53:37.900 --> 00:53:39.900
There's only so much we can do in camera.

00:53:43.900 --> 00:53:46.900
The odd thing is these conversations

00:53:48.900 --> 00:53:52.900
will be watched by people in India, in Bahrain, in Sydney, in places like that.

00:53:52.900 --> 00:53:55.900
And the great thing is your faces are turned away from it.

00:53:55.900 --> 00:53:57.900
My face is the one facing that.

00:53:58.900 --> 00:54:04.900
And better still, most people will think all these questions are coming from Diana anyways.

00:54:06.900 --> 00:54:09.900
Because she's the only one who asks questions.

00:54:11.900 --> 00:54:13.900
Oh, I did? Okay.

00:54:15.900 --> 00:54:18.900
And yet the reason I want to answer these questions is,

00:54:18.900 --> 00:54:22.900
I think it's important, particularly given where we are heading.

00:54:22.900 --> 00:54:25.900
I don't want this to be under wraps.

00:54:26.900 --> 00:54:27.900
Go ahead, Prashanth.

00:54:30.900 --> 00:54:31.900
Thanks, Wen.

00:54:33.900 --> 00:54:34.900
I can't hear you.

00:54:48.900 --> 00:54:51.900
Same with, go to Chad.

00:54:51.900 --> 00:54:53.900
Go to Mike Scandleberry.

00:54:54.900 --> 00:54:55.900
Talk to them.

00:54:56.900 --> 00:54:58.900
Or go to Derek. Go to me.

00:54:58.900 --> 00:55:00.900
Why even go outside? Go inside.

00:55:00.900 --> 00:55:02.900
Talk to Derek and talk to me.

00:55:02.900 --> 00:55:05.900
And in your case, if you have something, you can come directly to me.

00:55:06.900 --> 00:55:11.900
Yeah. If it was someone who was afraid of me,

00:55:11.900 --> 00:55:13.900
and you are not one of those,

00:55:13.900 --> 00:55:15.900
you can come directly to me.

00:55:15.900 --> 00:55:17.900
But if you think you can't come directly to me,

00:55:17.900 --> 00:55:20.900
then the two that you should go to first, if you can,

00:55:20.900 --> 00:55:23.900
and if they're trustable, and these are two guys who look trustable,

00:55:23.900 --> 00:55:25.900
it's Derek and me.

00:55:26.900 --> 00:55:30.900
After that, if they have to bring it first,

00:55:30.900 --> 00:55:34.900
and if it still doesn't work, and this problem is still outstanding,

00:55:34.900 --> 00:55:37.900
then you need to take it to Mike Scandleberry for one,

00:55:37.900 --> 00:55:38.900
Chad the other.

00:55:38.900 --> 00:55:42.900
Eddie is too far away right now to take it, but these two are near.

00:55:43.900 --> 00:55:44.900
Yeah.

00:55:45.900 --> 00:55:46.900
Yeah.

00:55:46.900 --> 00:55:48.900
Oh, that wasn't a tough question.

00:55:50.900 --> 00:55:52.900
Sorry, I have someone.

00:55:53.900 --> 00:55:55.900
Are you guys married?

00:55:56.900 --> 00:55:58.900
Go ahead, Eddie.

00:55:59.900 --> 00:56:02.900
I come from a...

00:56:11.900 --> 00:56:12.900
Same.

00:56:12.900 --> 00:56:19.900
So if May is a leader, and she's beating people up,

00:56:19.900 --> 00:56:25.900
then you then can either talk to her and say,

00:56:25.900 --> 00:56:29.900
don't beat me up, or you can bring it to me and say,

00:56:29.900 --> 00:56:33.900
May is beating me up, can you do something about it?

00:56:33.900 --> 00:56:39.900
And then if I sweep it under the rug and don't do anything with it,

00:56:39.900 --> 00:56:41.900
then you may need to go to Derek and say,

00:56:41.900 --> 00:56:44.900
I spoke to Jacob about May beating people up,

00:56:44.900 --> 00:56:46.900
but Jacob hasn't done something.

00:56:46.900 --> 00:56:49.900
Actually, if you could do that, I would say call the police.

00:56:50.900 --> 00:56:53.900
May is saying call the police first, but...

00:56:55.900 --> 00:56:57.900
But, okay, let's take out the beating button.

00:56:57.900 --> 00:57:00.900
Something like that, so you would take it to Derek.

00:57:00.900 --> 00:57:03.900
What are we doing here? We're following Matthew 18.

00:57:03.900 --> 00:57:08.900
And so now you've taken it to Derek, and now Derek talks to, say,

00:57:08.900 --> 00:57:11.900
Jane and they both come and talk to me about it again.

00:57:11.900 --> 00:57:13.900
How long will I sweep this under the carpet?

00:57:13.900 --> 00:57:16.900
At some point, you'll have to go to the two that I spoke to saying,

00:57:16.900 --> 00:57:19.900
we've tried this, and it keeps sweeping under the carpet.

00:57:19.900 --> 00:57:22.900
The only other option you have is to say, we are done with this,

00:57:22.900 --> 00:57:25.900
this is not healthy for us, let's run.

00:57:25.900 --> 00:57:27.900
Because this is not a safe or healthy place.

00:57:27.900 --> 00:57:28.900
Yeah.

00:57:36.900 --> 00:57:38.900
Yeah. Yeah.

00:57:38.900 --> 00:57:45.900
So we have a board, and if you want to know who all to approach,

00:57:45.900 --> 00:57:50.900
it would be Derek, May, who else?

00:57:50.900 --> 00:57:56.900
Heidi, Tooney, Jillian, and then you.

00:57:57.900 --> 00:57:59.900
Who else? Jane.

00:57:59.900 --> 00:58:02.900
Other people you can approach, Sue.

00:58:04.900 --> 00:58:06.900
And there was one more.

00:58:07.900 --> 00:58:10.900
Dawn. These are guys who lead.

00:58:10.900 --> 00:58:14.900
You can talk to them, tell them, whatever you need to.

00:58:14.900 --> 00:58:18.900
Be it finances, be it morality, be it spiritual issues, you take it to them.

00:58:18.900 --> 00:58:21.900
So are there any differences?

00:58:21.900 --> 00:58:24.900
I've tried to avoid elders.

00:58:24.900 --> 00:58:25.900
Why?

00:58:25.900 --> 00:58:31.900
Because churches have pigeonholed elders that's doing certain things,

00:58:31.900 --> 00:58:34.900
and they're trying to avoid the elders.

00:58:34.900 --> 00:58:36.900
So I've tried to avoid elders.

00:58:36.900 --> 00:58:37.900
Why?

00:58:37.900 --> 00:58:41.900
Because churches have pigeonholed elders that's doing certain things.

00:58:41.900 --> 00:58:45.900
Churches have pigeonholed elders that's doing certain things only,

00:58:45.900 --> 00:58:48.900
while I would say here are the qualifications.

00:58:48.900 --> 00:58:50.900
I've removed the term elders.

00:58:50.900 --> 00:58:53.900
I don't use the term elders, but here are the things that are required of a leader.

00:58:53.900 --> 00:58:56.900
One, can they teach?

00:58:56.900 --> 00:58:59.900
Two, are they living pure lives?

00:58:59.900 --> 00:59:01.900
Three, do they have a zeal for God?

00:59:01.900 --> 00:59:04.900
Four, do they convey the teaching faithfully?

00:59:04.900 --> 00:59:07.900
Five, do they run their homes well?

00:59:07.900 --> 00:59:11.900
These are the five requirements that are mentioned for any leader in the Bible,

00:59:11.900 --> 00:59:14.900
including elders.

00:59:14.900 --> 00:59:17.900
And if these five are met, then they qualify.

00:59:17.900 --> 00:59:19.900
Do you know that they qualify for elders?

00:59:19.900 --> 00:59:23.900
Because I meet with them personally and check their lives on a regular basis

00:59:23.900 --> 00:59:26.900
almost every week.

00:59:26.900 --> 00:59:31.900
Every week.

00:59:31.900 --> 00:59:35.900
These five or six I mentioned, or eight or seven or eight I mentioned,

00:59:35.900 --> 00:59:37.900
I check their lives every week.

00:59:37.900 --> 00:59:39.900
I actually check.

00:59:39.900 --> 00:59:42.900
Strangely enough, they come and ask to be checked.

00:59:42.900 --> 00:59:44.900
Go ahead, Vivi.

00:59:44.900 --> 00:59:46.900
By sitting with them and saying, how are you doing in this?

00:59:46.900 --> 00:59:48.900
What about your finances?

00:59:48.900 --> 00:59:50.900
Do you have a problem with pornography?

00:59:50.900 --> 00:59:52.900
Are you watching anything you should not be watching?

00:59:52.900 --> 00:59:53.900
What happened to that issue?

00:59:53.900 --> 00:59:55.900
You did not reconcile with this person.

00:59:55.900 --> 00:59:56.900
Have you reconciled?

00:59:56.900 --> 00:59:58.900
Your heart has this condition with this person.

00:59:58.900 --> 00:59:59.900
You told me about it.

00:59:59.900 --> 01:00:00.900
Has it changed?

01:00:00.900 --> 01:00:02.900
Have you forgiven that person?

01:00:02.900 --> 01:00:04.900
You had a problem in this area.

01:00:04.900 --> 01:00:06.900
What is the record?

01:00:06.900 --> 01:00:13.900
It is that nasty.

01:00:13.900 --> 01:00:14.900
I know.

01:00:14.900 --> 01:00:17.900
So there's no guarantee that whatever is being said to you,

01:00:17.900 --> 01:00:21.900
whatever you're trying to find out from them is absolutely 100% true.

01:00:21.900 --> 01:00:22.900
Actually is.

01:00:22.900 --> 01:00:23.900
These guys are.

01:00:23.900 --> 01:00:24.900
You can't assume that.

01:00:24.900 --> 01:00:25.900
No, no.

01:00:25.900 --> 01:00:29.900
When you begin to live with people, you begin to see them on a 24-7 basis almost.

01:00:29.900 --> 01:00:32.900
You begin to see whether Derek's life is real or not.

01:00:32.900 --> 01:00:34.900
I'm not taking any...

01:00:34.900 --> 01:00:35.900
No, no.

01:00:35.900 --> 01:00:36.900
I'm taking specifically.

01:00:36.900 --> 01:00:37.900
I'm taking Jillian.

01:00:37.900 --> 01:00:38.900
I'm taking...

01:00:38.900 --> 01:00:40.900
It's just a general question.

01:00:40.900 --> 01:00:41.900
Yeah.

01:00:41.900 --> 01:00:46.900
The amazing thing about living with people is you begin to see how they really...

01:00:46.900 --> 01:00:49.900
You're not even seeing them from a distance.

01:00:49.900 --> 01:00:51.900
I observed Derek and Iris...

01:00:51.900 --> 01:00:55.900
Derek's life separate and Derek's life now with Iris and the baby.

01:00:55.900 --> 01:00:56.900
How he is as a husband.

01:00:56.900 --> 01:00:58.900
How he is as a father.

01:00:58.900 --> 01:01:01.900
I see how Dawn loves Kezia.

01:01:01.900 --> 01:01:02.900
I check Jillian's life.

01:01:02.900 --> 01:01:04.900
I check Jane and Sheldon's life.

01:01:04.900 --> 01:01:12.900
I look at Sue's life and see how they're actually living when they're away from church.

01:01:12.900 --> 01:01:15.900
And don't think for a second that their lives are going well.

01:01:15.900 --> 01:01:16.900
Derek's makes mistakes.

01:01:16.900 --> 01:01:17.900
Jillian makes mistakes.

01:01:17.900 --> 01:01:18.900
Sue makes mistakes.

01:01:18.900 --> 01:01:20.900
Dawn makes multiple mistakes.

01:01:24.900 --> 01:01:25.900
Toonie.

01:01:25.900 --> 01:01:26.900
Oh my God.

01:01:26.900 --> 01:01:32.900
Toonie should have left the church by now.

01:01:32.900 --> 01:01:38.900
The only one who enjoys him being corrected is his wife.

01:01:38.900 --> 01:01:41.900
She sits there and laughs while he's being corrected.

01:01:41.900 --> 01:01:42.900
Pardon?

01:01:42.900 --> 01:01:43.900
I'm leaving soon.

01:01:43.900 --> 01:01:44.900
What?

01:01:44.900 --> 01:01:45.900
I'm leaving soon.

01:01:45.900 --> 01:01:46.900
Oh, you're leaving soon.

01:01:46.900 --> 01:01:47.900
Yeah.

01:01:47.900 --> 01:01:48.900
I'm leaving after the meeting.

01:01:48.900 --> 01:01:49.900
I'm leaving.

01:01:49.900 --> 01:01:50.900
I'm leaving.

01:01:50.900 --> 01:01:51.900
I'm leaving.

01:01:51.900 --> 01:01:52.900
I'm leaving.

01:01:52.900 --> 01:01:53.900
I'm leaving.

01:01:53.900 --> 01:01:54.900
I'm leaving.

01:01:55.900 --> 01:02:02.900
And then to take it further with the point Mark is saying, how can you be 100% sure?

01:02:02.900 --> 01:02:04.900
So that's through observable data.

01:02:04.900 --> 01:02:10.900
And then there is the Holy Spirit who gives the one who leads the church, doesn't matter who it is,

01:02:10.900 --> 01:02:15.900
and in this case me, who gives the one who leads the church the grace to build the church

01:02:15.900 --> 01:02:18.900
and to know something that is happening before it happens.

01:02:18.900 --> 01:02:21.900
We can't undermine that.

01:02:21.900 --> 01:02:23.900
That is so prevalent.

01:02:23.900 --> 01:02:24.900
Yeah.

01:02:24.900 --> 01:02:27.900
It's the same grace he gives parents.

01:02:27.900 --> 01:02:28.900
Yeah.

01:02:28.900 --> 01:02:31.900
How did my mother have eyes in the back of her head?

01:02:31.900 --> 01:02:35.900
When I grew up, it was missing.

01:02:35.900 --> 01:02:43.900
There is a grace that God gives the builder of a church to know what is happening before it even happens.

01:02:43.900 --> 01:02:44.900
Go ahead, Emmanuel.

01:02:44.900 --> 01:02:48.900
So, oh, you said the five of the boy is right.

01:02:48.900 --> 01:02:49.900
Yeah.

01:02:49.900 --> 01:02:55.900
So what happens if the specific leader falls short?

01:02:55.900 --> 01:02:56.900
Yeah.

01:02:56.900 --> 01:02:57.900
Yeah.

01:02:57.900 --> 01:03:03.900
So if the specific leader falls short, and every leader, including me, will fall short in some area or the other,

01:03:03.900 --> 01:03:07.900
is the leader doing anything to get better?

01:03:07.900 --> 01:03:11.900
If the leader, after one and a half years, let's give the leader 18 months to change,

01:03:11.900 --> 01:03:16.900
because anyone would give you and me 18 months to change, so let's give a leader 18.

01:03:16.900 --> 01:03:19.900
So, after 18 months, Derek is still not changing.

01:03:19.900 --> 01:03:26.900
Now there's a problem.

01:03:26.900 --> 01:03:28.900
And 18 months is a long time.

01:03:28.900 --> 01:03:31.900
You really cannot afford a leader 18 months.

01:03:31.900 --> 01:03:33.900
I would suggest three or four months.

01:03:33.900 --> 01:03:38.900
But in three or four months, if there is no change.

01:03:38.900 --> 01:03:42.900
Plus, there's another thing that we have to look at when we operate biblically.

01:03:42.900 --> 01:03:46.900
So, in the book, I assume, Vivian finds out that, who shall we pick on?

01:03:46.900 --> 01:03:47.900
May again.

01:03:47.900 --> 01:03:52.900
So Vivian finds out that May is not doing something well.

01:03:52.900 --> 01:03:54.900
And Vivian tells me about it.

01:03:54.900 --> 01:04:06.900
Anything brought against a leader should be confirmed by one or two witnesses, by two or more witnesses.

01:04:06.900 --> 01:04:10.900
It doesn't mean that two people have to say the same thing about May.

01:04:10.900 --> 01:04:15.900
Even if it happens two or three times, even that is two or three witnesses.

01:04:15.900 --> 01:04:20.900
So just because someone brings a complaint about a leader, does not mean you entertain it.

01:04:20.900 --> 01:04:26.900
According to the scriptures, if two or three witnesses bring a complaint against a leader

01:04:26.900 --> 01:04:33.900
in an area that is morally faulty or embezzling or any sin that is contagious, that's another thing.

01:04:33.900 --> 01:04:38.900
Always remember, we have to deal with sin that is contagious.

01:04:38.900 --> 01:04:39.900
It will begin to spread.

01:04:39.900 --> 01:04:41.900
So what are some of the sins that are contagious?

01:04:41.900 --> 01:04:55.900
Sexual sin, immorality, strife, discord, unforgiveness, gossip, slander, accusations.

01:04:55.900 --> 01:04:59.900
These are contagious sins.

01:04:59.900 --> 01:05:04.900
If these sins are prevalent, very little room should be given.

01:05:04.900 --> 01:05:05.900
Pardon?

01:05:06.900 --> 01:05:09.900
Yeah, tons of non-contagious sins that will not affect you.

01:05:09.900 --> 01:05:13.900
I might lie, it might not affect you.

01:05:13.900 --> 01:05:17.900
But even my lying becomes something that is now spreading like gangrene in the body.

01:05:17.900 --> 01:05:20.900
Yeah.

01:05:20.900 --> 01:05:24.900
So there are sins that are not contagious.

01:05:24.900 --> 01:05:31.900
Let's say May is not being smart with her money.

01:05:31.900 --> 01:05:37.900
But she's giving generously to the church, but you don't like the way she spends her money.

01:05:37.900 --> 01:05:40.900
That isn't a contagious sin.

01:05:40.900 --> 01:05:47.900
It may still not be what May is supposed to do, but it doesn't affect you in terms of her eating at Earls

01:05:47.900 --> 01:05:52.900
instead of eating at Mui Gardens.

01:05:52.900 --> 01:05:58.900
That shouldn't be a problem.

01:05:58.900 --> 01:06:00.900
Mui Garden is really good, eh?

01:06:00.900 --> 01:06:02.900
Really good. I was so surprised.

01:06:02.900 --> 01:06:04.900
And lots of food.

01:06:04.900 --> 01:06:07.900
Yeah. That's just on the side.

01:06:13.900 --> 01:06:16.900
Any other questions?

01:06:16.900 --> 01:06:21.900
So we will title this, teaching something completely different.

01:06:21.900 --> 01:06:26.900
It will be called deep, deep, deep, deep questions or something like that.

01:06:26.900 --> 01:06:28.900
It's definitely not.

01:06:28.900 --> 01:06:30.900
John 15, verse 7 and 8.

01:06:30.900 --> 01:06:32.900
Go ahead, Vivian.

01:06:32.900 --> 01:06:35.900
I'm not attacking you.

01:06:35.900 --> 01:06:41.900
Go for it. Yeah.

01:06:41.900 --> 01:06:55.900
Do leaders have the obligation to talk about their own personal struggles of the shape that they're in?

01:06:55.900 --> 01:06:57.900
Good question.

01:06:57.900 --> 01:06:59.900
Yeah, good question.

01:06:59.900 --> 01:07:07.900
Do leaders have the, are they obliged to or should they talk about Simon's problems?

01:07:07.900 --> 01:07:09.900
Let's say Simon has a problem.

01:07:09.900 --> 01:07:14.900
And I know you have just come new, but I just thought I'll take a shot at you too.

01:07:14.900 --> 01:07:16.900
So let's say Simon has a problem.

01:07:16.900 --> 01:07:18.900
And he tells me the problem.

01:07:18.900 --> 01:07:24.900
Am I supposed to then go tell Sheldon and Jane and May and Jillian and Tooney and Sue and do I tell everybody about it?

01:07:24.900 --> 01:07:27.900
Or am I only supposed to deal with it one on one?

01:07:27.900 --> 01:07:33.900
I wish there was some kind of a blanket statement I could make that this is how it is, but it doesn't work like that.

01:07:33.900 --> 01:07:38.900
So let's say you relate to May and you tell May something.

01:07:38.900 --> 01:07:42.900
May may think that it is important for me as the one in charge of the church to know.

01:07:42.900 --> 01:07:45.900
In which case, May is not telling me so that it's gossip.

01:07:45.900 --> 01:07:47.900
It's so that May and I can do something.

01:07:47.900 --> 01:07:51.900
Or I can tell May that this is perhaps how you need to deal with Vivian.

01:07:51.900 --> 01:07:52.900
Now why is she coming and telling me?

01:07:52.900 --> 01:07:55.900
Because in certain areas, I know more than May.

01:07:55.900 --> 01:07:56.900
How do I know more than May?

01:07:56.900 --> 01:07:59.900
One, because of the grace that is on my life because I lead the church.

01:07:59.900 --> 01:08:02.900
Two, because maybe I'm able to hear the Spirit better.

01:08:02.900 --> 01:08:04.900
Three, maybe because of some experience.

01:08:04.900 --> 01:08:09.900
And yet all three could be moot if God does not want to talk to me.

01:08:09.900 --> 01:08:12.900
But let's assume it's not to do with me.

01:08:12.900 --> 01:08:14.900
It's got to do with work.

01:08:14.900 --> 01:08:17.900
So May tells Jill, hey Jill, this is the area that Vivian is looking for.

01:08:17.900 --> 01:08:19.900
And Jill happens to be a leader.

01:08:19.900 --> 01:08:20.900
So May tells Jill, and Jill helps you.

01:08:20.900 --> 01:08:22.900
It must only be to help.

01:08:22.900 --> 01:08:25.900
If it is for the sake of, hey, you know what happened in Vivian's life.

01:08:25.900 --> 01:08:28.900
Then two things Vivian.

01:08:28.900 --> 01:08:34.900
One, God is highly possessive of us.

01:08:34.900 --> 01:08:42.900
And when your dignity, which should be cherished by leaders as it is cherished by God, is compromised.

01:08:42.900 --> 01:08:43.900
Two things happen.

01:08:43.900 --> 01:08:44.900
One, he's jealous.

01:08:44.900 --> 01:08:47.900
Two, he does not deal with May well then.

01:08:47.900 --> 01:08:48.900
We don't realize it.

01:08:48.900 --> 01:08:54.900
One of the things that we don't realize in our lives is we don't see consequences when they happen.

01:08:54.900 --> 01:09:04.900
If our eyes were open to the consequences that happen, we would be far more careful in walking.

01:09:04.900 --> 01:09:11.900
In the New Testament, they somehow knew that if you bring strife and discord into a church,

01:09:11.900 --> 01:09:15.900
that you will fall asleep or die.

01:09:16.900 --> 01:09:18.900
They knew.

01:09:18.900 --> 01:09:20.900
We don't have those things.

01:09:20.900 --> 01:09:21.900
We don't have fears like that.

01:09:21.900 --> 01:09:25.900
We don't have fears that if you bring strife and discord into this church,

01:09:25.900 --> 01:09:29.900
that you could die or you could fall sick.

01:09:34.900 --> 01:09:37.900
Because we are free from cause and effect and don't think of consequences.

01:09:39.900 --> 01:09:42.900
And so if Sen is causing strife and discord,

01:09:42.900 --> 01:09:45.900
you think I'm going to let her continue with it?

01:09:46.900 --> 01:09:49.900
Here's what a true pastor or father would do.

01:09:49.900 --> 01:09:53.900
He would not stop Sen because he wants to stop the strife and discord.

01:09:53.900 --> 01:09:57.900
He would stop Sen so that Sen does not suffer.

01:09:57.900 --> 01:10:00.900
And then he would look after the strife and discord.

01:10:12.900 --> 01:10:17.900
Having said all this, remember James 3, verse 1 and 2.

01:10:17.900 --> 01:10:27.900
Jacob, if you're teaching this stuff, you will be judged by a standard that's twice as hard as Dillner or Mayer or Pawan or Lenny.

01:10:34.900 --> 01:10:38.900
One of the things I try to do is see cause and effect so that I'll stop in my path.

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Oh, sorry, I'm scratching that thing again.

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Alrighty.

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Thanks for being a very strange church.

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Let's pray.

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Father, that didn't go anywhere where I wanted it to go.

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It went everywhere else.

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When I thank you that you have been with me,

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and everywhere else, when I thank you that as we finish,

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there's only, and I think I speak for the entire church, Father, not just for me.

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There's only a sense of peace and almost satisfaction

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and even a tinge of laughter at how this meeting went.

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Thank you for each one who asked questions, Father.

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For Jill who started it off.

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For Vivian, for Pashant, for Marcus, for Dillner.

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Thank you for the questions that were asked, Father.

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So we go as people that are grateful for a God who will always be true and always be loving,

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who will never fail.

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Build this place up for the way you want it to, Father.

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Like Jill said, help us to walk that fine line between raising and connecting.

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Like Jill said, help us to walk that fine line between raising and controlling.

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It's a thin line, Aba.

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The way we not be afraid of abuse and compromise the truth.

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Walk that line.

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Teach us, Spirit of God, we come to you.

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We said we want to learn from you.

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Show these depths, O God, so that we may build a house.

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Help me, Aba, so much in one sense depends on my hard attitude.

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Yeah, people can go to Pastor Mike and people can go to Chad.

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But Paul put it this way.

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But even though it's a fearful thing, I'd rather fall into the hands of the living God.

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So hold me accountable, too.

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Thank you, Father.

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We go now.

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And we'll try John 15, 7 and 8 next week.

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In Jesus' name, Amen.

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Bless you guys.